Ithaca Model 37 Schematic

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 6:52 am
Chuck Findley wrote:I forgot to add unless you find an untouched gun with the serial number starting in 38 then part 13 would be different.



What changed in the carrier, Chuck?
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 7:15 am
It wasn't much of a change, spurs on the carrier. It was supposed to help with ejecting the spent shell. The carrier was changed back. However, you will find spurs on the shell carrier on several guns made after that.

There was something else about the 38 serial number range guns. I will have check on that and get back.
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 7:22 am
Chuck Findley wrote:It wasn't much of a change, spurs on the carrier. It was supposed to help with ejecting the spent shell. The carrier was changed back. However, you will find spurs on the shell carrier on several guns made after that.

There was something else about the 38 serial number range guns. I will have check on that and get back.



hey thanks for the info, Chuck!
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 8:14 am
the carriers hes talking about were basicly all recalled ,and they were replaced with the standard carrier.

if you find a 38 with the spurred carrier its a pretty rare piece,as most were retrofitted.


also on early (real)early m37s they used only 1 extractor (top i think) and very quickly a 2nd was added all singlr extractor guns were recalled and retrofitted the 2nd extractor.
and early m37 with a single extractor is also extreamly rare to find
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 11:56 am
I am having a vision of what spurs on the carrier could do to paper hulled shells.....
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 6:37 pm
Actually there are other differences in the guns marked with the 38 prefix (1975). besides the carriers
The shell stops were different and the action bar was notched to allow this to work. The new system was supposed to eliminate the hand fitting required.

This didn't work and all of the guns with the 38 prefix were recalled and repaired. If you should find one that has not been touched it is very very rare.

The topless extractor models my friend from Pennsylvania is talking about is is really really early. A left over from the parent gun the Remington 17. From what I have read there is only one left serial #2023.
Last edited by Chuck Findley on Sat Mar 24, 2012 8:46 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 8:17 pm
I have often wondered why Ithaca had problems with out the top extractor. My model 17 has always worked fine. I wonder if it was because the 12 gauge shell is bigger and harder to extract (the 17 was made in 20 only. Any guesses?
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2012 4:12 am
Well, a 12 ga shell is heavier and that extra weight could cause a shell to drop prematurely. the other one could be swollen hulls which might cause the extractor to slip
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2012 7:59 pm
I don't know serial #2023 dates to 1937. So the double extractors is an improvement on the original design.

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 25, 2012 10:21 am
Chuck Findley wrote:I don't know serial #2023 dates to 1937. So the double extractors is an improvement on the original design.

Their where 3500 guns made in 1937 starting with serial number 1. I have 2 first year production guns one in the 7xx range and one in the 25xx range. Both have been "updated" to the double extractors. From time to time I come across other first year guns on Gun Broker and they all seem to be updated as well. My guess is that they most likely updated all but a handful of them.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 26, 2012 10:47 am
1977cutcher wrote:
Chuck Findley wrote:I don't know serial #2023 dates to 1937. So the double extractors is an improvement on the original design.

Their where 3500 guns made in 1937 starting with serial number 1. I have 2 first year production guns one in the 7xx range and one in the 25xx range. Both have been "updated" to the double extractors. From time to time I come across other first year guns on Gun Broker and they all seem to be updated as well. My guess is that they most likely updated all but a handful of them.


I would agree, like I said before from what I have read (Mr Snyder's book) only the one remains with the single extractor. There could be more its anyones guess.
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 26, 2012 12:18 pm
Chuck Findley wrote:
1977cutcher wrote:
Chuck Findley wrote:I don't know serial #2023 dates to 1937. So the double extractors is an improvement on the original design.

Their where 3500 guns made in 1937 starting with serial number 1. I have 2 first year production guns one in the 7xx range and one in the 25xx range. Both have been "updated" to the double extractors. From time to time I come across other first year guns on Gun Broker and they all seem to be updated as well. My guess is that they most likely updated all but a handful of them.


I would agree, like I said before from what I have read (Mr Snyder's book) only the one remains with the single extractor. There could be more its anyones guess.



If there is another I would bet that a) you could auction it off for a very healthy figure and b) the person who would own it, would have NO idea what he has.
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 26, 2012 3:00 pm
along the thought of people and guns they have no idea about

i think about how many gorgeous guns have been melted down in them "guns for nike sneaker " deals
that PDs often hold
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2012 1:00 pm
i just noticed my 75 starting with 371 has a spurred carrier in it

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2012 3:19 pm
twistedoak wrote:along the thought of people and guns they have no idea about

i think about how many gorgeous guns have been melted down in them "guns for nike sneaker " deals
that PDs often hold


I know exactly how you feel. For the sake of not opening another can of worms I will refrain from further
comment.

twistedoak wrote:i just noticed my 75 starting with 371 has a spurred carrier in it


If memory serves the 38 prefix dates to 75. Ithaca used the old style or spurred carriers through out the mid to late 70s. Remember, the company was going through bankruptcy around this timeframe.

Besides, most factory shells were plastic. So the spurs were not really to much of an issue.
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2012 4:14 pm
well you are right ,
the spurred carriers were in 75 , however i thought the spurred carrier itself was the reason for the "38" designation.
the 38 ended when the spurred carrier ended, correct?

and if they recalled the spurred carrier from the 38s why would they use it in any of the 37s?

but in the end i'm refering to an exectutive model and ithaca could have done anything with it including using discontinued,or soon to be discontinued carriers

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2012 5:44 pm
twistedoak wrote:well you are right ,
the spurred carriers were in 75 , however i thought the spurred carrier itself was the reason for the "38" designation.
the 38 ended when the spurred carrier ended, correct?

and if they recalled the spurred carrier from the 38s why would they use it in any of the 37s?

but in the end i'm refering to an exectutive model and ithaca could have done anything with it including using discontinued,or soon to be discontinued carriers

According to Walter Snyder on page 257 the spurred carrier was used on some of the early model 38 guns however this was not intended to be the difference between the 37 and the 38. The main difference between the 37 and the 38 was a new type of shell stop that is explained on pages 255 and 256. About 20,000 guns where made with the different shell stop and the serial number on the gun will start with a 381 instead of a 371.

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2012 6:05 pm
You have to remember the shell stoop and action bar were the real change. This is the reason for the recall. Keep in mind that an untouched 38 will be rare. There we go again with the word rare.

The spurred carriers were used through out the mid to late 70s The mix and match era.

Keep in mind the executive model was basically the supreme model, a plain one at that. It was also a limited run 1000 guns. These however, were the top of the line guns for that time.
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2012 7:03 pm
ahh ok forgot about the shell stop ,,,guess i should look and see which one i have.

what i ment about the exec comment was the gun was born only because of excess supream grade wood.
since the wood was more expensive then the gun itself was,there would be little profit margin.
so using the most cost effective part onhand wouldn't suprise me
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2012 7:07 pm
Chuck Findley wrote:
twistedoak wrote:along the thought of people and guns they have no idea about

i think about how many gorgeous guns have been melted down in them "guns for nike sneaker " deals
that PDs often hold


I know exactly how you feel. For the sake of not opening another can of worms I will refrain from further
comment.

twistedoak wrote:i just noticed my 75 starting with 371 has a spurred carrier in it


If memory serves the 38 prefix dates to 75. Ithaca used the old style or spurred carriers through out the mid to late 70s. Remember, the company was going through bankruptcy around this timeframe.

Besides, most factory shells were plastic. So the spurs were not really to much of an issue.


Chuck, My uncle was still using paper shells in the '70's. I think we went through the last bunch I think in 76 or 77. I still have a box of 20 gauge plastic Remingtons that have GREEN hulls floating around someplace.
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 31, 2012 4:44 pm
RGS,

That is true I saw paper shells through the mid to late 70s but but by that time the norm had become plastic as far as factory loads went.

Wow, green hull 20ga shells I have always remember them as having yellow hulls.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 01, 2012 6:34 am
No No Chuck, these were 60's vintage shells. He used to buy them a flat at a time.
I'll have to take a picture of one of the spent shells I have to show you. Many people don't believe me when I tell them that Remington used to make their 20 gauge shells in green. Ironically they came in a Red Box. I remember seeing 20 shells in a range of colors, from Red to blue to green, but everyone changed to yellow, when I guess some yahoos were dropping 20 gauge shells into their 12 gauge guns by mistake. I guess reading the headstamp is just too much trouble.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2012 8:43 pm
ravengunsmith wrote:No No Chuck, these were 60's vintage shells. He used to buy them a flat at a time.
I'll have to take a picture of one of the spent shells I have to show you. Many people don't believe me when I tell them that Remington used to make their 20 gauge shells in green. Ironically they came in a Red Box. I remember seeing 20 shells in a range of colors, from Red to blue to green, but everyone changed to yellow, when I guess some yahoos were dropping 20 gauge shells into their 12 gauge guns by mistake. I guess reading the headstamp is just too much trouble.


Well reading the headstamp on a shell can be to much trouble for some. I honestly remember only yellow shells for 20 ga. That said I remember seeing 12 ga shells in colors other than red and 16 ga shells in other colors than the purple, a color that I have associated with 16s.

Come to think of it the only shell I have seen in one color is the 28ga, I have only seen red ones.
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 07, 2012 10:59 am
Chuck Findley wrote:
ravengunsmith wrote:No No Chuck, these were 60's vintage shells. He used to buy them a flat at a time.
I'll have to take a picture of one of the spent shells I have to show you. Many people don't believe me when I tell them that Remington used to make their 20 gauge shells in green. Ironically they came in a Red Box. I remember seeing 20 shells in a range of colors, from Red to blue to green, but everyone changed to yellow, when I guess some yahoos were dropping 20 gauge shells into their 12 gauge guns by mistake. I guess reading the headstamp is just too much trouble.


Well reading the headstamp on a shell can be to much trouble for some. I honestly remember only yellow shells for 20 ga. That said I remember seeing 12 ga shells in colors other than red and 16 ga shells in other colors than the purple, a color that I have associated with 16s.

Come to think of it the only shell I have seen in one color is the 28ga, I have only seen red ones.


Apparently so, but I do remember seeing green remington and Red Winchester paper 20 shells and then green and red plastic ones, I have a couple empties that I use to test extraction and ejection. I remember shooting some peters paper shells in blue, too. 16 gauge no less. I wish I knew then what I know now, I would have saved every last paper shell.
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 26, 2013 6:17 pm
Found this. Part nomenclature legend may prove useful.

Ithaca37ExView.gif
Found this diagram with part nomenclature legend.
Ithaca37ExView.gif (67.95 KiB) Viewed 20281 times
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